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From: Bulent Aliev <atlasyts@bellsouth.net>
Subject: Re: [FlyRotary] Re: Latest EC2 updates, Installation notes
Date: Sat, 14 Oct 2006 22:55:26 -0400
To: "Rotary motors in aircraft" <flyrotary@lancaironline.net>

First time I hear about the twisted / shielded pairs for the coils?  
Fortunately I have twisted and shielded wire from my strobes  
installation. I see some re-wiring work in my future :) Among other  
things......
Buly

On Oct 14, 2006, at 9:34 PM, Kelly Troyer wrote:

> Mark and all,
>
> Isn't it great what we all learn from those of this group that go  
> before us !!
>
>  We all will look so smart when we do not have the same problems !!
> --
> Kelly Troyer
> Dyke Delta/13B/RD1C/EC2/EM2
> Mistral Backplate
>
>
>
>
> -------------- Original message from "Mark R Steitle"  
> <mark.steitle@austin.utexas.edu>: --------------
>
>
> > Tracy,
> >
> > OK, confession time. ;-)
> >
> > Ref. #1 - The wires are about 5 ft from EC-2 to coils, but could  
> be shortened by
> > a foot or so if that would help. As for wire routing, everything  
> is bundled
> > together, but I am now in the process of fixing that mistake. I  
> plan to route
> > the injector leads out through the firewall in a separate bundle.  
> Same goes for
> > the coil trigger leads.
> >
> > Ref. #2 - Power ground wires were bundled in with the rest (A,B,C  
> & D), but for
> > only about a foot down near the coils. I've since removed them  
> from what is
> > left of the bundle. They are now about 2" long and connected to  
> the coil
> > mounting bolts/bracket. There are two ground wires running fr om  
> the coil
> > bracket to the engine block (shares bolt with ground strap).
> >
> > Ref. #3 - Yes, power leads share common bundle and are not  
> twisted pairs.
> >
> > Ref #4 - With all the extra room in the existing bundle, I could  
> easily change
> > to twisted pairs. I'll wait to do this until the other items are  
> done.
> >
> > Ref #5 - Yes, injector leads are in the same bundle, but will be  
> removed from
> > the bundle and re-routed. (See #1)
> >
> > Alright, so what did I do right? After reading your response, I  
> guess its no
> > wonder that it ran at all. Hopefully, the newbies will take heed  
> and follow
> > Tracy's suggestions to the letter.
> >
> > Mark S.
> >
> > ________________________________
> >
> > From: Rotary motors in aircraft on behalf of Tracy Crook
> > Sent: Sat 10/14/2006 10:02 AM
> > To: Rotary motors in aircraft
> > Subject: [FlyRotary] Re: Latest EC2 update s, Installation notes
> >
> >
> > Opps, signed off too quick to catch that Mark. Below is what I  
> wrote to Bob
> > Darrah on the subject. Have not heard back from him yet. I am  
> surprised that
> > there is any cross-talk in the harness as the GM harness does not  
> seem to have
> > this problem in the car. The harness in the plane is either much  
> longer or
> > something else is going on.
> >
> > Need a few details on harness routing to answer your question.
> > 1. How long is the wiring harness between EC2 and coils?
> > 2. How is the power ground to the coils (A terminals) routed?  
> (hopefully not in
> > the same harness, if so, there is your problem).
> > 3. Same question as 2. on the power terminals.
> > 4. I would be surprised if this turned out to be the problem but  
> if coupling
> > between the control lines themselves (C pins) turns out to be the  
> problem, use
> > either twisted pairs or shielded wires to d rive the B & C lines  
> to each coil. I
> > would lean toward twisted pairs.
> > 5. Are there any other lines routed along with the coil harness  
> (injector
> > drives, etc)?
> >
> > Tracy
> >
> > ----- Original Message -----
> > From: Mark R Steitle
> > To: Rotary motors in aircraft
> > Sent: Friday, October 13, 2006 4:39 PM
> > Subject: [FlyRotary] Re: Latest EC2 updates, Installation notes
> >
> > Tracy,
> > Before you sign off, can you shed some light on my previous post
> > concerning cross-firing of the coils and what to do abou it?
> >
> > Thanks,
> > Mark S.
> >
> > ________________________________
> >
> > From: Rotary motors in aircraft on behalf of Mark R Steitle
> > Sent: Mon 10/9/2006 8:31 AM
> > To: Rotary motors in aircraft
> > Subject: [FlyRotary] Re: Latest EC2 updates, Installation notes
> >
> >
> >
> > OK, I'll chime in here. After reading Bob Darrah's post last week  
> where
> > he noticed a big improvement after separating the leads to his  
> coils I gave it a
> > try on my 20B. It made a big difference, but was most noticeable  
> in the lower
> > rpm range. I was only able to separate the wires down near the  
> coils, and then
> > only by a small amount, but it made a substantial improvement. My  
> question for
> > Tracy is, can I leave the grounds and +14v wires bundled together  
> and only
> > separate the trigger leads, or do I need to separate all the  
> wires? Also, if I
> > were to use 3 individual shielded wires and ground the shields,  
> could I then
> > bundle the trigger leads together with the rest of the coil wires?
> >
> >
> >
> > On a side note, after separating the coil leads, it took a much  
> leaner
> > mixture to get it to run smooth. Before, the best it would idle  
> wa s about
> > 1200rpm, now it will idle nicely at 900 rpm, not that I want to  
> do that, but it
> > shows that the improvement isn't all in my head.
> >
> >
> >
> > Mark S.
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> > ________________________________
> >
> > From: Rotary motors in aircraft  
> [mailto:flyrotary@lancaironline.net] On
> > Behalf Of Wendell Voto
> > Sent: Saturday, October 07, 2006 11:08 PM
> > To: Rotary motors in aircraft
> > Subject: [FlyRotary] Re: Latest EC2 updates, Installation notes
> >
> >
> >
> > Tracy,
> >
> > Would shielded cables be okay to run close together in a fiberglass
> > aircraft?
> >
> > Thanks,
> >
> > Wendell
> >
> > ----- Original Message -----
> >
> > From: Tracy Crook
> >
> > To: Rotary motors in aircraft
> >
> > Sent: Wednesday, October 04, 2006 9:31 AM
> >
> > Subject: [FlyRotary] Re: Latest EC2 updates, Installation notes
> >
> >
> >
> > While trouble shooting Al Gietzen's EC2 engine controller  
> problems, he
> > mentioned that he was seeing relatively large mixture changes  
> when the
> > alternator was switched off and the battery voltage went low. The  
> mixture goes
> > leaner with lower battery voltage because the injectors take  
> longer to open. It
> > was well within the range of the manual mixture control to  
> correct but it got me
> > to thinking about adding battery voltage compensation to the EC2.  
> This has been
> > done and all controllers shipped after 9-20-06 now incorporate  
> this feature.
> > Not a freebie, but if anyone wants this incorporated into an  
> earlier EC2 it can
> > be retrofitted.
> >
> >
> >
> > The other update is a rev limiter. It was easy to do so I went  
> ahead and
> > added it. I haven't seen thi s as a priority because in our  
> application if you
> > make use of it, it means that you need to be more concerned about  
> the pilot's
> > health than the engine's (the prop has fallen off the airplane).  
> The default
> > rev limit is 8000 rpm. If you want something different, specify  
> when ordering.
> > (Also retrofittable)
> >
> >
> >
> > EC2 / EM2 Installation Note.
> >
> >
> >
> > This only applies to EC2 engine controller installations combined  
> with
> > early two-part EM2 engine monitors in canard aircraft where both  
> units are
> > installed near the engine and have long wiring harnesses  
> connecting them to the
> > EC2 front panel and EM2 display (a rare combination that may be  
> unique to Al's
> > airplane). Have been working with Al for some time searching for  
> the cause of
> > random MAP table and other EC2 parameter corruption. I am now  
> almost certain
> > that the cause is noise coupling from th e EM2 display harness  
> into the EC2
> > control panel harness. The two harnesses were laced together in Al's
> > installation. He is in the process of separating them now  
> (sympathies to Al,
> > no picnic). Needless to say at this point, never run these two  
> harnesses
> > together and separate them as far as practical. I think Al will  
> have about 4
> > inches between them when separated.
> >
> >
> >
> > Tracy Crook, RWS
> >
> > --
> > Homepage: http://www.flyrotary.com/
> > Archive and UnSub: http://mail.lancaironline.net/lists/flyrotary/
> >
> >
> >
>
> From: "Mark R Steitle" <mark.steitle@austin.utexas.edu>
> Date: October 14, 2006 9:22:31 PM EDT
> To: "Rotary motors in aircraft" <flyrotary@lancaironline.net>
> Subject: [FlyRotary] Re: Latest EC2 updates, Installation notes
>
>
> <winmail.dat>
> --
> Homepage:  http://www.flyrotary.com/
> Archive and UnSub:   http://mail.lancaironline.net/lists/flyrotary/
>
>
> --
> Homepage:  http://www.flyrotary.com/
> Archive and UnSub:   http://mail.lancaironline.net/lists/flyrotary/