Return-Path: Received: from ms-smtp-03.southeast.rr.com ([24.93.67.84] verified) by logan.com (CommuniGate Pro SMTP 4.1.3) with ESMTP id 2564562 for flyrotary@lancaironline.net; Tue, 02 Sep 2003 07:04:48 -0400 Received: from o7y6b5 (clt78-020.carolina.rr.com [24.93.78.20]) by ms-smtp-03.southeast.rr.com (8.12.5/8.12.2) with SMTP id h82B2dxl002698 for ; Tue, 2 Sep 2003 07:02:40 -0400 (EDT) Message-ID: <002901c37141$b48c1c80$1702a8c0@WorkGroup> From: "Ed Anderson" To: "Rotary motors in aircraft" References: Subject: Re: [FlyRotary] and another one fly's.... Date: Tue, 2 Sep 2003 07:02:30 -0400 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="----=_NextPart_000_0026_01C37120.2D2FB7E0" X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1106 X-MIMEOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 This is a multi-part message in MIME format. ------=_NextPart_000_0026_01C37120.2D2FB7E0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Congratulations, Todd! Glad you discovered the exhaust gasket leak = quickly and before anything was seriously damaged. Don't know about the = IVO, but one thing I found out was that all of Van's performance figures = are for Constant Speed Props. Like for my RV-6A, his best rate of climb = airspeed is listed as somewhere around 90 MPH, however, with a fixed = pitch cruise prop, the best rate of climb airspeed is closer to 120 MPH. = I really felt like I had a dog initially as at 90 mph I was only = getting around 700-800 fpm, but once I went to 120 MPH for best climb, = rate of climb went up to 1200-1400 fpm. Your temps seem quite good for a first flight. My prop is 68 x 72 two = blade wooden, so your 76" diameter prop (with three blades) sounds like = a bit much. But of course, you can adjust the pitch to compensate = somewhat for the greater prop diameter's load. Again, heartest congratulations on your new bird Best Regards Ed Anderson ----- Original Message -----=20 From: Haywire=20 To: Rotary motors in aircraft=20 Sent: Tuesday, September 02, 2003 2:43 AM Subject: [FlyRotary] and another one fly's.... Hi Guy's 13:32 PST another rotary climbed into the air, 3 years and a month = after construction started. It was worth every single sacrifice. I made = an attempt to record flight data, but was kinda excited to do a good job = of it, and now I'm enjoying a couple of beers, but I'll give an outline = of events and post better data after more flights. First flight only lasted 18 minutes, as we could faintly smell oil = burning, so returned for inspection. On removal of cowl we found that = the oil injection lines had melted off of their attachment to the = metering pump. Even though I felt it was unlikely we speculated that = heat from the exhaust may have caused it. So I replaced these and = sleeved them with Hi-temp 3/8 hose. The second flight was supposed to be = a short hop just to test this but as everything was working we continued = on. This lasted 42 minutes. Upon inspection after landing we discovered = the protective sleeve burned but this showed me the source of the heat = appears to be the turbo manifold gasket seems to be leaking, directing a = stream of hot exhaust gases. As it was too warm to investigate further = we decided to call it a day and get some beer. Tomorrow I'll remove the = turbo and exhaust and investigate further. I just hope that the manifold = hasn't cracked. Temps on climb out peaked at 98C (208F) for the coolant and 95C = (203F) for the oil. I was running the EWP on bypass from the controller, = meaning it would just run at a full 12v supply continuously. This caused = me an anxious moment when on descent on the first flight, as it suddenly = dropped of below the bottom of the scale and pressure dropped from 20psi = to 5psi. I thought we'd sprung a leak but as soon as we landed and began = to taxi temps climbed back to 80C. I guess I'll have to start trusting = the electronic temp controller to maintain temps. I'm experiencing similar disappointment as Rusty in my climb = speeds. However on the second flight we used the GPS to do a few runs to = check the airspeed we found that it reads 15-20 mph slow. This meant we = were climbing at too high of an airspeed. Even when we adjusted for this = is was still disappointing. I feel that a big part over the problem may = be that I'm over-propped. I'm currently using a 76" 3-blade IVO prop, = which may need to be shortened. I've got allot of testing to do before I = shorten it however. I have heard all the good and bad reports on the IVO = prop, so I was already aware that it may not be ideal or may be perfect, = but decided that I'd like to find out for myself.=20 I have to commend my test pilot Ron, who took care of most of the = flying duties while I closely watched the engine (he let me have a few = minutes of stick time on each flight). The airframe handled beautifully, = flies like a dream. It required a little left rudder on take-off, no = rudder at all at 130-160mph and a little right rudder above 160. Both = landings were perfect greasers, so I guess tomorrow I'll have to do = landing just to test the gear :-) It was a pretty successful day with a few snags to be dealt with, = but damn it feels great..... WhaaaaHooooooo S. Todd Bartrim=20 Turbo 13B RV-9Endurance C-FSTB http://www3.telus.net/haywire/RV-9/C-FSTB.htm "Whatever you vividly imagine, Ardently desire, Sincerely believe = in, Enthusiastically act upon, Must inevitably come to pass".=20 ------=_NextPart_000_0026_01C37120.2D2FB7E0 Content-Type: text/html; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable
Congratulations, Todd!  Glad you = discovered=20 the exhaust gasket leak quickly and before anything was seriously = damaged. =20 Don't know about the IVO, but one thing I found out was that all of = Van's=20 performance figures are for Constant Speed Props.  Like for my = RV-6A, his=20 best rate of climb airspeed is listed as somewhere around 90 MPH, = however, with=20 a fixed pitch cruise prop, the best rate of climb airspeed is closer to = 120=20 MPH.  I really felt like I had a dog initially as at 90 mph I was = only=20 getting around 700-800 fpm, but once I went to 120 MPH for best climb, = rate of=20 climb went up to 1200-1400 fpm.
 
Your temps seem quite good for a first = flight. My=20 prop is 68 x 72 two blade wooden, so your 76" diameter prop (with three = blades)=20 sounds like a bit much.  But of course, you can adjust the pitch to = compensate somewhat for the greater prop diameter's load.
 
Again, heartest congratulations on your = new=20 bird
 
Best Regards
 
Ed Anderson
 
 
----- Original Message -----
From:=20 Haywire
Sent: Tuesday, September 02, = 2003 2:43=20 AM
Subject: [FlyRotary] and = another one=20 fly's....

Hi=20 Guy's
   =20 13:32 PST another rotary climbed into the air, 3 years and a month = after=20 construction started. It was worth every single sacrifice. I made an = attempt=20 to record flight data, but was kinda excited to do a good job of it, = and now=20 I'm enjoying a couple of beers, but I'll give an outline of events and = post=20 better data after more flights.
   =20 First flight only lasted 18 minutes, as we could faintly smell oil = burning, so=20 returned for inspection. On removal of cowl we found that the oil = injection=20 lines had melted off of their attachment to the metering pump. Even = though I=20 felt it was unlikely we speculated that heat from the exhaust may have = caused=20 it. So I replaced these and sleeved them with Hi-temp 3/8 hose. The = second=20 flight was supposed to be a short hop just to test this but as = everything was=20 working we continued on. This lasted 42 minutes. Upon inspection after = landing=20 we discovered the protective sleeve burned but this showed me the = source of=20 the heat appears to be the turbo manifold gasket seems to be leaking,=20 directing a stream of hot exhaust gases. As it was too warm to = investigate=20 further we decided to call it a day and get some beer. Tomorrow I'll = remove=20 the turbo and exhaust and investigate further. I just hope that the = manifold=20 hasn't cracked.
   =20 Temps on climb out peaked at 98C (208F) for the coolant and 95C (203F) = for the=20 oil. I was running the EWP on bypass from the controller, meaning it = would=20 just run at a full 12v supply continuously. This caused me an anxious = moment=20 when on descent on the first flight, as it suddenly dropped of below = the=20 bottom of the scale and pressure dropped from 20psi to 5psi. I thought = we'd=20 sprung a leak but as soon as we landed and began to taxi temps climbed = back to=20 80C. I guess I'll have to start trusting the electronic temp = controller to=20 maintain temps.
   =20 I'm experiencing similar disappointment as Rusty in my climb speeds. = However=20 on the second flight we used the GPS to do a few runs to check the = airspeed we=20 found that it reads 15-20 mph slow. This meant we were climbing at too = high of=20 an airspeed. Even when we adjusted for this is was still = disappointing. I feel=20 that a big part over the problem may be that I'm = over-propped. I'm=20 currently using a  76" 3-blade IVO prop, which may need to be = shortened.=20 I've got allot of testing to do before I shorten it however. I have = heard all=20 the good and bad reports on the IVO prop, so I was already aware that = it may=20 not be ideal or may be perfect, but decided that I'd like to find out = for=20 myself.
   =20 I have to commend my test pilot Ron, who took care of most of the = flying=20 duties while I closely watched the engine (he let me have a few = minutes of=20 stick time on each flight). The airframe handled beautifully, flies = like a=20 dream. It required a little left rudder on take-off, no rudder at all = at=20 130-160mph and a little right rudder above 160. Both landings were = perfect=20 greasers, so I guess tomorrow I'll have to do landing just to test the = gear=20 :-)
   =20 It was a pretty successful day with a few snags to be dealt with, but = damn it=20 feels great.....   WhaaaaHooooooo

S. Todd Bartrim 
Turbo 13B=20 RV-9Endurance
C-FSTB
http://www3.telus.net/haywire/RV-9/C-FSTB.htm

=    "Whatever you vividly imagine, Ardently desire, = Sincerely=20 believe in, Enthusiastically act upon, Must inevitably come to pass".=20

 
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