X-Virus-Scanned: clean according to Sophos on Logan.com X-PolluStop-Diagnostic: (direct reply)\eX-PolluStop-Score: 0.00\eX-PolluStop: Scanned with Niversoft PolluStop 2.1 RC1, http://www.niversoft.com/pollustop Return-Path: Received: from smtpauth06.mail.atl.earthlink.net ([209.86.89.66] verified) by logan.com (CommuniGate Pro SMTP 4.3c4) with ESMTP id 865990 for flyrotary@lancaironline.net; Tue, 12 Apr 2005 09:38:22 -0400 Received-SPF: pass receiver=logan.com; client-ip=209.86.89.66; envelope-from=jerryhey@earthlink.net Received: from [65.176.161.171] (helo=earthlink.net) by smtpauth06.mail.atl.earthlink.net with asmtp (Exim 4.34) id 1DLLa6-0006qk-F9 for flyrotary@lancaironline.net; Tue, 12 Apr 2005 09:37:38 -0400 DomainKey-Signature: a=rsa-sha1; q=dns; c=simple; s=test1; d=earthlink.net; h=Date:Subject:Content-Type:Mime-Version:From:To:In-Reply-To:Message-Id:X-Mailer; b=IPwA1GuDAGZQ1CNniK/VR9GGodfRVmRaTZwlnwofSVXTIuRsKtuLTBKu8vt2P12t; Date: Tue, 12 Apr 2005 08:39:00 -0500 Subject: Re: [FlyRotary] Re: Latest on the Motor Trouble Content-Type: multipart/mixed; boundary=Apple-Mail-10--285528821 Mime-Version: 1.0 (Apple Message framework v552) From: Jerry Hey To: "Rotary motors in aircraft" In-Reply-To: Message-Id: <3A65D9AC-AB58-11D9-A355-0003931B0C7A@earthlink.net> X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.552) X-ELNK-Trace: 8104856d7830ec6b1aa676d7e74259b7b3291a7d08dfec79037e0239405cc3aefd14feab28b81e00350badd9bab72f9c350badd9bab72f9c350badd9bab72f9c X-Originating-IP: 65.176.161.171 --Apple-Mail-10--285528821 Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary=Apple-Mail-11--285528820 --Apple-Mail-11--285528820 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII; format=flowed Paul has a good point about the air filter even if it's absence had nothing to do with the current problem. Sooner or later, something undesirable will be sucked in, especially if one occasionally visits a dirt strip. Given the value of our engines and the time put into them, an alternate source of filtered air when conditions warrant its use seems really important to me. Admittedly it can be a very difficult "option" to implement given the price of real estate under the cowl. My plenum, presently under construction has both ram and filtered air. The ram inlet is on top of the cowl like a hood scoop. A single flapper valve selects the air source. It does require relocating the alt. Here is a drawing. Jerry --Apple-Mail-11--285528820 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Type: text/enriched; charset=US-ASCII Paul has a good point about the air filter even if it's absence had nothing to do with the current problem. Sooner or later, something undesirable will be sucked in, especially if one occasionally visits a dirt strip. Given the value of our engines and the time put into them, an alternate source of filtered air when conditions warrant its use seems really important to me. Admittedly it can be a very difficult "option" to implement given the price of real estate under the cowl. My plenum, presently under construction has both ram and filtered air. The ram inlet is on top of the cowl like a hood scoop. A single flapper valve selects the air source. It does require relocating the alt. Here is a drawing. 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vR1KsMi1BGQTyDmgDraKKKACiiigAooooAKKKKACiiigAooooAKKKKACiiigAooooAKKKKACiiig AooooAKKKKACiiigAooooAKKKKACiiigAooooAKKKKACiiigAooooAKKKKACiiigAooooAKKKKAC iiigAooooAKKKKACiiigAooooAKKKKACiiigAooooAKKKKACiiigAooooAKKKKACiiigAooooAKK KKACiiigAooooAKKKKACiiigAooooAKKKKACiiigAooooAKKKKACiiigAooooAKKKKACiiigAooo oAKKKKACiiigAooooAKKKKACiiigAooooAKKKKACiiigAooooAKKKKACiiigAooooA//2Q== --Apple-Mail-10--285528821 Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary=Apple-Mail-12--285528819 --Apple-Mail-12--285528819 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1; format=flowed On Monday, April 11, 2005, at 09:54 PM, Paul wrote: > Hey, Ed....so sorry to hear about your engine misfortune (as well as=20= > the washing machine).=A0 Do you have an air cleaner?=A0 Is there any=20= > possiblity your prop could have blown loose rock/pebbles or FOD into=20= > your intake?=A0 Obviously you will find out soon...just speculating = and=20 > curious about any filter or screen you may have on your intake system.=20= > Good luck with the engine rebuild....we will miss your flying reports=20= > for a while, but hopefully just for a short while.=A0 Paul Conner > =A0 > > ----- Original Message ----- > From: Ed Anderson > To: Rotary motors in aircraft > Sent: Monday, April 11, 2005 6:57 PM > Subject: [FlyRotary] Latest on the Motor Trouble > > Latest status on the engine problem: > =A0 > Unfortunately a breakdown in one of the households most important=20 > appliances ( in the wife's view), i.e. - the washing machine precluded=20= > me getting the engine unbuttoned today.=A0 Got as far as getting the=20= > flywheel nut off when got side tracked. > =A0 > However, here are some interesting tidbits.=A0 Al told me he could=20 > not=A0find an NGK=A0B9EQV - odd I thought- since I purchased some.=A0 = Well=20 > when I opened up the tool box there as plain as day was B9EGV - the=20 > CORRECT PLUG - I am beginning to feel like I am in the twilight zone.=A0= =20 > All four -all are the B9EGV! > =A0 > So the right plug - so how come the problem or was it all an figment=20= > of my troubled mind?=A0 > =A0 > No figment about the problem, I could better examine the apex seals=20 > through the exhaust with a bright light.=A0 I found one apex seal=20 > shattered into three pieces, one stuck down as if springs are broken=20= > and one which appears to move normally in its slot, but has nicks.=A0=20= > Well as we all know when two of the apex seals are gone on a rotor=20 > they might as well all three be gone. > =A0 > Now here is where it gets a bit more spooky - I took one of the B9EGV=20= > plugs and screw them into an 86 NA rotor housing (thanks for the=20 > suggestion, George - down under) I have laying around.=A0 I then=20 > measured from the inside of the housing to the ground electrode of the=20= > plug - hold onto your hats - it measured 7.5 mm!=A0 I could be off by = a=20 > mm but certainly places the electrode no where close to the chamber=20 > (relative speaking).=A0 > =A0 > So either the 91 turbo housings (will find out tomorrow) have shorter=20= > sparkplug holes OR the plugs had nothing to do with the problem.=A0=20 > Possibly some other FOD item - but I use no nuts or screws any place=20= > in the induction system that would cause them to fall off into the=20 > runners.=A0 > I've already reported that the next most likely candidate - pieces of=20= > the plastic plenum were a negative as all pieces are still in place. > =A0 > I really hate to end the day without getting the bottom of this=20 > problem, but just too beat to tackle it.=A0 Sitting here in front of = the=20 > computer with a cool brew - which is something I don't ever recall=20 > doing before (not the drinking, and not the computer - but both=20 > together!) > =A0 > I am taking photos as I disassemble the engine.=A0 It took me 15 = minutes=20 > once I had the engine on the work stand to get Tracy's gearbox, damper=20= > plate, flex plate and flywheel nut off.=A0 Next comes the flex plate, = my=20 > broken-bolt shield and then the 17 tension bolts (guess I better=20 > remember to put heat shrink on them).=A0 > =A0 > Anyhow, thanks to all of you who had suggestions, comments or=20 > condolences conveyed to me.=A0 Appreciate them all and I will keep you=20= > informed as the disassembly progresses. > =A0 > =A0 > Ed > Ed Anderson > Rv-6A N494BW Rotary Powered > Matthews, NC > eanderson@carolina.rr.com > > > > > > > > No virus found in this incoming message. > Checked by AVG Anti-Virus. > Version: 7.0.308 / Virus Database: 266.9.6 - Release Date: 4/11/2005 > --Apple-Mail-12--285528819 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Content-Type: text/enriched; charset=ISO-8859-1 =20 On Monday, April 11, 2005, at 09:54 PM, Paul wrote: ArialHey, Ed....so sorry to hear about your engine misfortune (as well as the washing machine).=A0 Do you have an air cleaner?=A0 Is there any possiblity your prop could have blown loose rock/pebbles or FOD into your intake?=A0 Obviously you will find out soon...just speculating and curious about any filter or screen you may have on your intake system. Good luck with the engine rebuild....we will miss your flying reports for a while, but hopefully just for a short while.=A0 Paul = Conner =A0 ----- Original Message ----- From: 1999,1999,FFFFEd Anderson To: 1999,1999,FFFFRotary motors in aircraft Sent: Monday, April 11, 2005 6:57 PM Subject: [FlyRotary] Latest on the Motor Trouble ArialLatest status on the engine problem: =A0 ArialUnfortunately a breakdown in one of the households most important appliances ( in the wife's view), i.e. - the washing machine precluded me getting the engine unbuttoned today.=A0 Got as far as getting the flywheel nut off when got side tracked. =A0 ArialHowever, here are some interesting tidbits.=A0 Al told me he could not=A0find an NGK=A0B9EQV - = odd I thought- since I purchased some.=A0 Well when I opened up the tool box there as plain as day was B9EGV - the CORRECT PLUG - I am beginning to feel like I am in the twilight zone.=A0 All four -all are the = B9EGV! =A0 ArialSo the right plug - so how come the problem or was it all an figment of my troubled = mind?=A0 =A0 ArialNo figment about the problem, I could better examine the apex seals through the exhaust with a bright light.=A0 I found one apex seal shattered into three pieces, one stuck down as if springs are broken and one which appears to move normally in its slot, but has nicks.=A0 Well as we all know when two of the apex seals are gone on a rotor they might as well all three be gone. =A0 ArialNow here is where it gets a bit more spooky - I took one of the B9EGV plugs and screw them into an 86 NA rotor housing (thanks for the suggestion, George - down under) I have laying around.=A0 I then measured from the inside of the housing to the ground electrode of the plug - hold onto your hats - it measured 7.5 mm!=A0 I could be off by a mm but certainly places the electrode no where close to the chamber (relative speaking).=A0 =A0 ArialSo either the 91 turbo housings (will find out tomorrow) have shorter sparkplug holes OR the plugs had nothing to do with the problem.=A0 Possibly some other FOD item - but I use no nuts or screws any place in the induction system that would cause them to fall off into the = runners.=A0 ArialI've already reported that the next most likely candidate - pieces of the plastic plenum were a negative as all pieces are still in place. =A0 ArialI really hate to end the day without getting the bottom of this problem, but just too beat to tackle it.=A0 Sitting here in front of the computer with a cool brew - which is something I don't ever recall doing before (not the drinking, and not the computer - but both together!) =A0 ArialI am taking photos as I disassemble the engine.=A0 It took me 15 minutes once I had the engine on the work stand to get Tracy's gearbox, damper plate, flex plate and flywheel nut off.=A0 Next comes the flex plate, my broken-bolt shield and then the 17 tension bolts (guess I better remember to put heat shrink on them).=A0 =A0 ArialAnyhow, thanks to all of you who had suggestions, comments or condolences conveyed to me.=A0 Appreciate them all and I will keep you informed as the disassembly progresses. =A0 =A0 ArialEd ArialEd Anderson Rv-6A N494BW Rotary Powered Matthews, NC = 1999,1999,FFFFeanderson@carolina.rr.com < No virus found in this incoming message. Checked by AVG Anti-Virus. Version: 7.0.308 / Virus Database: 266.9.6 - Release Date: 4/11/2005 = --Apple-Mail-12--285528819-- --Apple-Mail-10--285528821--